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American Land Seller Podcast
Welcome to The American Land Seller, the podcast dedicated to landowners, buyers, and investors seeking expert insights into the evolving land market. Hosted by Koby Rickertsen, an Accredited Land Consultant and Multi-State Land Broker with High Point Land Company, this show dives deep into market trends, investment strategies, and real-world experiences in farm, ranch, and recreational land sales.
Each episode features industry professionals, seasoned investors, and landowners sharing their expertise on topics such as:
✅ Land market trends and valuation strategies
✅ 1031 exchanges and tax implications
✅ Seller financing and creative deal structures
✅ Conservation easements and government programs
✅ Navigating legal and zoning challenges
✅ Building generational wealth through land ownership
Whether you're a first-time land buyer, a seasoned investor, or a landowner looking to sell, The American Land Seller provides the knowledge and tools you need to succeed in today’s competitive land market.
American Land Seller Podcast
#42 - Inside the Marketing Machine at National Land Realty
Featuring Mac Christian, Chief Marketing Officer
How do you support over 400 land agents across 43 states—with just six marketing team members? In this episode of The American Land Seller, Mac Christian, CMO of National Land Realty, breaks down the real systems, strategies, and struggles behind one of America’s largest land brokerage marketing operations.
You’ll learn:
- How National Land Realty builds consistent branding across the country
- Why trust and relationships beat logos in rural real estate
- What it takes to support agents with collateral, lead gen, and digital campaigns
- How podcasting and storytelling help land agents grow their presence
- Why Mac got his real estate license—and what he learned from it
Whether you're a land broker, real estate marketer, or someone curious about how large brokerages operate behind the scenes, this episode offers practical insight and refreshing honesty.
Mac shares what’s working, what’s broken, and what every land professional should know about building a brand in the land business.
👉 Visit https://www.nationalland.com to learn more about National Land Realty
👉 Visit https://www.nationalland.com/blog/category/podcast/ to listen to Mac on the National Land Realty Podcast which is also found on Spotify and Apple Podcast and other places podcasts are available. IT REALLY IS GREAT!
👉 For more episodes, visit https://www.americanlandseller.com
Today on the American Land Seller, we're going to find out what it's really like to run marketing for one of the biggest land brokerages in the country. Matt Christian is the Chief Marketing Officer at National Land Realty, a 400 plus agent powerhouse with reach in 46 states. But he's not just building a national brand. He's also training local agents to win in their own backyards. In this episode, we talk about what it's like to leave marketing in a juggernaut like National Land, how to balance global strategy with grassroots agent success, why land-based podcasts are attracting the most interesting characters, and how Mac's recent jump into getting his Idaho real estate license gives him a little more respect for the agents he works with every single day. We swap podcast stories, marketing lessons and a few hot takes on what actually works and what doesn't when you're trying to stand out in today's land world, whether you're a solo broker or part of a large team. This one's packed with insight you're guaranteed to take something away from.
Speaker 2:Welcome to the American Land Seller Podcast with your host, kobe Rickardson. Kobe is an accredited land consultant and multi-state land broker with High Point Land Company. Join us each week as we explore all things land. We bring you fresh insights and expert guests on sales, marketing, regulations, economics and so much more. Visit wwwamericanlandsellercom and find us on one of your favorite podcast platforms. Okay, kobe and our special guests, let's get started.
Speaker 1:All right, we are back with Mac Christian from National Land Realty. Mac, how are you today?
Speaker 3:I am doing very well, thank you.
Speaker 1:Mac, this is kind of exciting for me. I am a huge fan of yours, my friend, I listen to your podcast all the time, and so it's kind of an honor to have you on here to talk about what it's like to be the marketing like the director of marketing for a real estate juggernaut like National Land Realty. So what is it like to be the director of marketing for a big time name like National Land Realty?
Speaker 3:It's very cool. It's an industry I didn't expect to find myself in. Earlier in my career I started, you know, I did work enterprise level tech and I've done agency work and it's just that I've always tried to get myself into the outdoors world. It's just kind of it's my life and roundabout, found a way through here and got on board with National Land. It's got a really, really terrific culture. Is the big thing that? I'm a culture zealot and so getting on board with National Land and then the scale of things that we get to operate with. We've got a ton of agents, ton of offices. There's a lot to juggle there's it's never a dull day and I have it. I have.
Speaker 3:I get a lot of credit that I am not due because I mean like I, you know, like I work as chief marketing officer and I've got to. Yeah, I get my name out there because I do our podcast and stuff. Yeah, I get my name out there because I do our podcast and stuff. But it's that everyone who does the actual things is under me and I get the sort of credit for what they do and that I don't like that. But it's, it's a really cool thing. It's a really cool team. Everything from our operations team to our technology team all collaborates. Our CEO, ronnie Richardson, is always in and out of talking with us and it's just, it's a, it's kind of a family it's. It's a cool, it's fun.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you guys. I mean like your marketing team is pretty impressive. I mean they, you guys, are always like what's the next thing? I mean you can just tell and, and what you're putting out there as a product, how many people do you have working for you? We?
Speaker 3:have. You're going to make me count. I hate math. No, it's part of what I. No, we have, total is six Now we have. So we I call it the skeleton crew Anything, anything that you operate with in real estate, you're always going to be it's juggling dollars, and so we operate a skeleton crew.
Speaker 3:We have we have very siloed roles. Everyone owns their division of the house. Um, whatever duties you have, you're in charge of those. I I'm very much not a micromanager. I've worked under my.
Speaker 3:The whole opportunity of leading a team is the ability to do the things that I've always hated and take them away and do the things I've always wanted to do and give it to my team, and so I give them ownership.
Speaker 3:Uh, my goal when I I've kind of I've hired all of them and trained all of them, um, and now and now that my director is is an absolute marketing monster, she does a lot of the training now instead of me, which is really cool. I like that, but it leaves me looking for things to do, um, so, yeah, no, it's it's uh, there's a copywriter designer, uh, digital marketer, uh, crm specialist director and a social media specialist, uh, that we work with and um, it's just, uh, it's it there. Each one of them executes their tasks very, very, very well. Our copywriter too. He keeps us in task. You talked about the new media stuff where we're kind of staying on top of the news cycle. We have regular meetings weekly, monthly where we bounce ideas and then we do morning scrums to establish like what's the headline? We better be talking about this, and so we always kind of have that stuff going on.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that is like I think that's what you guys do like exceptionally well is that you are talking about what is like what is relevant, um, which is fascinating, because I think a lot of us in this industry we get so caught up in like what you know, like I don't know, the mundane day-to-day stuff that we forget about the fact that we are impacting the industry, where we need to be the voice in the industry, and so like what, like I know that's a collective thing from from your group, but but I think that kind of is one of those things is, is that one of the reasons why they brought you on is is kind of like somebody has to have that pulse right, like somebody has to keep their pulse on what's going on in the world and and what do we need to be paying attention to?
Speaker 3:Yeah, well, so the model of how National Land was built was to be able to let let agents in the field do what they do, which is working with buyers and sellers of land right, like that's what they do, and regardless of specialty, we want to get them in the field as much as possible to do their job, and so they built the premise of the company off of taking as much as we can off of their plate that takes away from the buying and selling of land right? So can we do lead gen? Can we do collateral production? Can we? Because about half of what my team does is supporting agents. So I need a listing presentation, I need something like that. So we run a lot of stuff like that. So we try to support as much as we can and also generate new business for them.
Speaker 3:And the one thing that we always hear from our agents and it's this tug of war right, like when I came on board, it was kind of a dogfight and we've been able to communicate with each other enough to where we've got a good understanding, but it's always this tug of war of I don't have time to do things like run my social media, or I don't have time to run my email Like anybody in the field, right? Like any agent in the field, that's it right. I don't have time to hop on Facebook and tell them what I did today, like that's the thing.
Speaker 1:Or you're at 7.30, eight o'clock at night and be like dang. I forgot to do it all Exactly, yeah, yeah. I forgot all about it. Yeah, yeah, I get you.
Speaker 3:I joke about it, but it's like, because I'm kind of in, it is like it's like it's the field of ADD, right.
Speaker 3:Like it's like we all get sucked into our thing that we're interested in. We run around and we're like agents are talkers and they're communicators and they go out and they work with people in the field. Half the time you don't have cell phone reception so you couldn't post anyways. And so it's this balancing act of like can I get the material into the agent's hand to where, hey, if you didn't do anything, take any pictures today, can you post what we did as news or and it's sort of like. Can we give you the material to build a social media following?
Speaker 3:Can we help you run your email and the hard part is we can't do those things for agents but we can give them the material for them to do it faster. And, like you know, if I didn't take a picture today, can I pull something from home office and post that. That's. That's kind of what it's built we. We built it on sales enablement, which is a weird marketing jargon that nobody wants to learn anyways basically means I'll give you the tools to do your job. I can't do your job for you.
Speaker 1:No, that's empowering your agents. I think what's fascinating with what National Land does is you guys have taken principles that a ton of residential companies have been doing for and I'm not trying to insult you, but I know.
Speaker 3:I see where you're headed. You can call me Remax here in a second.
Speaker 1:No, no, but you've taken principles though that, like a lot of the you know, like the big time successful you know residential companies have done and you've said you know what we can take some of the good business practices that they've done, we can improve on them and maybe you know, hand this kind of similar stuff to our guys. You know, and and again, like I've talked to you know, to your leadership, you know, through passing through the, you know industry things and I know their goal was at least at one point, and I think it continues to be we're going to be the top tech people. We're going to be the top, you know. I think technology land company at one point was their goal, right.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, there's a. There's a heavy, heavy focus on our, on our technology team. A heavy, heavy focus on our, on our technology team. Um, we've got, uh, tyler Van Meteren is our, is our uh, cto over there. Um, he's, he's a monster. His team is monstrous. They're terrific. They do all kinds of weird.
Speaker 3:The hard part with marketing, the hard part with technology, is none of this stuff is sexy, right, and none of it gets in front of agents. So half the time, agents in the field are like what the heck do you guys do? And it's like well, I worked all day on things you'll never see, and it's, and it's really that like it's, it's numerical, it's. We're working on databases behind the scenes to like, okay, how do we manage properties better with you know our property management system and we, we build a lot of things behind the scenes. We have our LandTour 360 technology was one of the first things they did. That's a super cool thing that we've done and continue to do, you know we. And then there's other things like integrations with CRM systems and how can we automate things, and so our tech team does a ton of our heavy lifting. Again, it's where it's like I sort of get to dance and sing songs in front of people, and our technology is doing this heavy lifting behind the scenes, and sometimes I'll get credit for some of that stuff.
Speaker 1:It's like no, it's not me Going back to the marketing aspect of that, though. I mean it just helps your guys. It makes it a lot easier for them to have that online presence, that social media presence, by creating that um for your, by your team and by the tech team, by creating that easy way for them to you know plug and play type of thing I would guess you know, like the, the social media, um, put the images where they need to be and the branding is all wraps right around that, and then you just throw it right out there on your social media, and then that is the sexy part of it, right, yeah that is that's.
Speaker 3:That's the part that's so visible, right it's. What's funny is for every image that goes in there, there's huge process that goes behind it with like 15 steps and it's like a project management system and like building out that system is the really exciting part of marketing, like. But it's stuff that like, if you're not in marketing, this is the most uncool thing you've ever heard in your life. Snooze button immediately. But when you put it all together and like the person comes in, they put in a request, they get something cool at the end and like and they thank you for it, you're like there we go, that's the one, that's the one.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's, it's, it's, it's. It's a large technology process driven process that we, that we do and again, not me, my team executes perfectly nearly every time there's really and there's. I always encourage my team to make mistakes, because that's sort of our way is like I want you to go around and break things and then we find what we broke and then you fix it and because of that, they kind of they kind of don't break things, which is kind of freaks me out a little bit.
Speaker 1:But building it so good.
Speaker 3:I don't know, I wouldn't credit myself that far. They're executing very well. So it's no, it's just a cool thing. I like the company, I like the culture. It's yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and again, like we we have similar, like we have our marketing team and stuff like that to make us look good. And you know, like that that's just I mean, that is that is an important part of of our companies, is just the you know, you guys that are that are building that stuff and making making our lives as agents and as brokers way easier. But if you don't mind, mac, we're going to take a quick break and we'll be right back. The American land seller podcast is brought to you in part by land hubcom. Join us today and experience the expertise of LandHub's land marketing professionals. Whether you're buying or selling, let us show you the way in the ever-evolving world of land transactions. Visit LandHubcom and discover what the future of land marketing looks like. Landhubcom where your land journeyubcom, where your land journey begins. All right, we're back here with mac christian from national land realty.
Speaker 1:Mac, we were just talking during the break. You know, um, I think that, um, it's interesting. Um, you were telling me something that you, you know, like, I think I think about subconsciously, but I never really said it out loud. But you know, like there's two, two things that you're having to focus on. You know, like you have that global brand right, or that national brand that you're pushing out there, that you, you know that's where you have. Like the color has to be like exactly the same hue and the you know they're not quite john deere green and yellow, but you know, like whatever, and then oh you called it, you called it you called us out.
Speaker 3:Uh, that was like when I came on board, there was like a bunch of people that were like you know, it looks like john deere, like is that not cool to you? Like it's there, we have shifted the scheme a little bit to highlight white a little more and uh, but yeah, it's, we got the green and yellow you know, I had to, I had to do that.
Speaker 1:I mean, I, I, uh, I, I we have like a really fun pastel colors. So you know, like the neon blues, and yeah, yes, we're, we're, we have, we have, uh, we have our own color, color fun. But um, no, um. But what I was trying to say is going back into it though, like how, teaching your agents that, how do we get that local connection? You know, because that's the reality is, is you and I both know people deal with people, right?
Speaker 1:The brand is a tool. I mean that's honestly I've. I had my own company, I sold it, I, I this is my you know second company that I've been with since I sold my company and so I look at it simply as the brand is a tool, right Um?
Speaker 1:and so and so I'm the that connection for my company and in my region. Um talk about how you're encouraging your guys and how, what, what national land is doing like locally in some places to kind of promote that brand and and marketing yeah, and that's that is the.
Speaker 3:That is the ever-present dynamic of real estate marketing. Or in the land industry. I've been a part of two companies I've had the privilege of working with Land Leader and now I'm with National Land Realty, and the same dynamics exist there. And I talk to other marketers and it exists, I think, in every company. And it's this dynamic of agents are in the field and they want to know that their company is known of and, uh, you know, the company is trying to get out there and do the thing. But also, marketing costs money. So then it's this dynamic of like okay, yes, I could be on every billboard and TV set in your state. What are you willing to drop in the marketing fee wise? And they're like well, I don't want to give you any extra money, I just want to be on all the TVs. And I was like sorry, that cost. So it's this balancing act of and if I'm an agent in the field, I'm asking the same questions. It's just that I'm on the other side of it now and I've got to answer those questions. And so the big one is, you know, agents are constantly talking to us about like you know, I talked to this person today and they'd never heard of national land realty. It's like okay, well, like, let's, let's dive into that conversation a little bit. And the.
Speaker 3:The harsh truth is what you just said is that people do business with people like in the example that's really easy to use is everyone follows elon musk, especially in the last 48 hours. Everyone follows elon musk because he lightened the place on fire, but having a week, isn't he having a week? He's having it. It's a. The hot tea is getting spilled. Um, but let's take that dynamic. Everybody is following that and I and like let's take social media for an example, but not a single one of us has ever probably followed tesla, and that's the prime example of the. And then let's take it on the other part. Elon Musk gets political and that falls out of favor with certain parts of the population and it collapses.
Speaker 3:The brand. Now, what had more power? The brand itself or the person? 100% the person. That guy just did something weird and people didn't like it and his brand collapsed. Just did something weird and people didn't like it and his brand collapsed. And so the brand power. Now let's not take away from branding right, like, branding matters, people knowing of an organization really matters and everybody wants to get to that place.
Speaker 3:But when it comes down to it, it's like when somebody says I haven't heard of your company, a lot of the times that means who are you? Like I've never they're. They're trying to be polite and not say who the heck are you, bob? Like I've never heard of you. Man, like am I going to do business with you? And so it's like I've never heard of your company and it's an unfamiliarity thing.
Speaker 3:There is that, and especially in our industry right, we're talking rural communities Like I don't, I come from small town Idaho. And it's like I moved away for a few years and went back home and I got the line of like you weren't from here anymore. It's like, oh my gosh, I grew up here. Are you serious? You've got to have that low, it doesn't matter your brand. Like you've got to know the people, you've got to be in front of them.
Speaker 3:There's that personal side and so from our point in in, from marketing capacity, it's like we hustle and flow to get everything we can in front of people, but there is a cost limitation and it's like if, if agents are willing to put in, you know, above and beyond, we can manage it, but nobody wants to, because that's the money you feed your family with.
Speaker 3:And there's this constant balancing act that is going on between Mark and, and it's even more so because agents have no idea what we do, like we are the weird monkeys behind the screen that like well, okay, like why haven't you made me popular in my area, dude? You're sitting on your laptop all day. Why haven't you done this? And it's completely understandable, right, but at the same time, there is this thing going on behind the scenes and it is marketing on a national level, and it's like I can't be everywhere at once. I have no idea what's going on in Missouri, you know. So it's like it's the, it's. It is a constant push, pull and it's and it's the best part is having a team that cares, cause then you want to do those things, but yeah, it's, it's hard.
Speaker 1:Well and to your point, like if you're in Idaho trying to help an agent in Missouri, you can actually hurt them if you start. You know, like I've seen that before where you know, like with Remax, I thought it was funny because, like I had a, I had a one of the guys that competed against me, like you know, remax would have a palm tree and something I was going to say, like is this the Rockyax would have a palm tree and something.
Speaker 3:when we were I was going to say, like is this the Rocky Mountains? I live in Missouri.
Speaker 1:And so it was always like this little twerp 20-year-old agent with another company. That was always like. I don't remember palm trees being in Nebraska, kobe, you know on my social media and I'm like I will squash you, son.
Speaker 3:And it's even worse in rural communities because it's like people are very in. In rural america people are very protective, because they should be right, because people come in from out of town and what they're used to is someone taking advantage of them, of some big talking person coming in and selling them on something they don't need and they go in for it and one of their relatives got ripped off or something and they're leery and and like that's common, they should be, and so being able to market on a familiar level I had. I had contracted an agency at one point with another company that, um, they used a bunch of pictures of deer and they're like, oh, we got deer on there. Like no, that's ireland dude, that's a red deer. Like what? There's what? What is that? Like that, let's just pretend this didn't happen. Don't ever do that again.
Speaker 1:Or or the track that is not a tractor we have in this country. You know we're not. That's not the kind of tractor we have in the United States. You're going to have to. One is from Japan. Most, most farmers are going to figure that out real quick that they've never seen that at a, at a state fair no, it's not it.
Speaker 3:So yeah, to your point. And I've had, like you know, I considered myself pretty savvy, my I I get like a hillbilly discount because I grew up in a small town and, like my team didn't a lot most Most of my team because they're marketers. Right, they're not, they're not outdoors types. I've integrated them into the outdoor lifestyle, but a lot of them look to me to answer things. But uh, you know, we have, we have Germans, jeremy Stevens over there in Arkansas. He's blown me up a couple of times. It is like this is not a row crop. We have Mac and like help me out, yeah.
Speaker 1:And you get down into like Texas I have row crop here but you get down into like Texas and the South and stuff and they have cotton. We have never seen that here.
Speaker 3:And exactly from it's.
Speaker 1:it's gotta be a tough, it's gotta be tough to have that job to market across this bigger area, as you guys are Cause you're, are you all 50 states now, or?
Speaker 3:43 states, 103 offices at this point, 430, some agents, yeah, big dogs it's, uh, there's, there's a lot to keep track of. You know what it really is is we have a really organized filing system to where it's like, okay, these are missouri photos, these are arkansas photos. This is texas photos. You know there's trying to keep track of. You know there's, this is high fence versus no high fence. To where it's like, okay, these are Missouri photos, these are Arkansas photos, this is Texas photos. Trying to keep track of this is high fence versus no high fence.
Speaker 1:I imagine that it is a lot to keep track of.
Speaker 3:I have to fall back on. I have a monster designer that manages it and, again, my director QA's everything, and they do a phenomenal job. We have the processes like regardless of the person, if you have a good process, that's not going to break, and so you make sure that you follow the process every time like OK, did I get this approved? We go through an approval system, make sure we got it right before we execute stuff. Every single time, it's when we get crowded and we work too fast. Failure happens, and so it's like whenever anything goes wrong, it's like okay, were you moving too fast? Okay, let's go back to that.
Speaker 1:Let's go back to the process no, that's that, that is, uh, that is a true statement, though it's always when you're moving too fast that failure happens.
Speaker 3:It is it, and and for us especially, like every time we try to tackle too much or juggle too many things and you convince yourself that you, I got this, I can do, I can handle. Well, I can handle that too, and before you know it, it's like you forgot to tie your shoes and projects collapse and somebody's mad yeah.
Speaker 1:So if you were to give a young agent starting out with national land realty umty say you're having a mentoring session with them on marketing what's your first advice to them? How do you get them out there? What's your best advice to give them to get going?
Speaker 3:So my number one and because I do sit down with agents quite a bit like we have marketing tools and everybody in our industry has a marketing tool and everybody has sort of like I call them their shiny thing, right, like, oh, we have this and our competitors don't have this, and that's what everybody gets sold on. It's a TV show, it's a magazine, it's a social media presence, it's a banner on the highway, whatever it is. Everybody has their shiny thing. And if that shiny thing matters to an agent, the agent signs up with that company and you know, like half of our industry is recruiting. You want good agents for your company that's how your company grows and new agents when they come on board especially.
Speaker 3:I'll take, for example, uh, someone who's never done real estate, that's a pretty good one. The big one is how many people do you know in your community? Sorry, this is going to fall down to your friends, family and loved ones. Granny might not buy from you, but she probably knows somebody who has land that you can talk to. Or you grew up in that area and people remember you from high school football, or people remember you from debate team, or you were, you know. You know you cheerleaded for years and now and now you're selling land, whatever it is. Do you have a name? Can you build a name? And in the big one it's just shake some dang hands. It is all. It's stuff that I can't help with. Like, you either have that hustle or you don't. You can meet people or not and Co-marketing is huge right, like market to residential realtors and see if you can pull them on board for market to co-marketing contracts.
Speaker 3:If you're trying to get rolling and and meeting landowners, I I keep on talking about it because it's how I ended up getting half of the areas that I hunted when I was in college was like we would take pie to landowners, like hey, I brought you a pie, is it okay if I hunt quail? Like and like I've always talked to them like man, take somebody a pie no one ever turns down pie like and just tell them you want to get to know them and don't try to sell, because people hate to get sold to. They want to know they can trust you. And like get out there, shake hands and be trusted and talk to people and then follow up and don't hassle them and don't sell to them. They know what you do. You don't have to beat them over the head with what you do. You just need to be known.
Speaker 3:And and land is something where there's always this confused like. We always go to a circle of like where did the lead come from and how do they work with you? And it's like, okay, like that matters a little bit, but we're not selling. I don't sell tennis shoes. I didn't see a discount on Google, or I didn't see a discount on REI's website and go buy it that day. It's not a product like that, like the. The idea is you have to be known and come to mind when they decide to move that piece of land, which means you need to be trusted and in touch with them, and it's not like you sell land every other day. So this is like you need to be the one that they think of. Get out and just start meeting people, because no one's going to trust you out of the gate. Like, you've got to be trusted and build that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's like the seven and six rule, Like you have seven, seven times and then they kind of have an idea who you are and then every six months your face better come across them, Otherwise they'll forget who you are, type of deal you know, like that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I don't know if that's an old rule or a current rule or not, but it's still kind of true, right yeah yeah, and it's not the boiler room anymore, right, like you're not going to make a phone call and no one's going to give you their life savings. It is like land is the most valuable thing they've ever known. This is the most valuable thing anybody has in their life. They're not just going to give it to you. Like, you have to like be trusted and be in touch and stay organized, right. Like whether it's a CRM system or a spreadsheet or you got a notebook with everybody's name. You got to work your way through that, like once a month. Like cool, I'll reach out, I'll touch base, religious about it, like those I don't want to take away from my team and myself, but that stuff matters more than anything we could ever do.
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, and I think what I love what you just said about like go snuggle up to the residential agents and partner with them, like that's so smart, because you actually have a product that they don't have. You've got the horsepower to market and sell land in a way that they can't do it as well, as you have contacts that are going to buy and sell houses that they may not have too. And so I love that, because a lot of people in our industry, I think, get a little bit arrogant in the sense of they think that residential market is pretty easy, and I don't think that at all.
Speaker 3:Oh, residential market is the nastiest. I would not touch that market if you paid me double my salary, just because every one of them is in a dogfight every day and it's a little similar to land, but there's not many land agents. You take a residential marketer in a city or a residential real estate agent in a city and it's like I can't even imagine. I mean cause there's a lot.
Speaker 1:Yeah, there are a lot of them and yeah, it's but, and again it's, there's a lot of things that go into marketing homes. You know, and a lot of knowledge you have to have. You know it's not, but again it's different knowledge that we have that you know that that we can be an asset to them as long as we're going in and telling them what kind of an asset we can be.
Speaker 3:You know referrals for yeah, cause they get land pickups and, like you've got residential agents, they can look at a marble countertop and they can tell you what country it came from, but then you start talking to them and they don't even know what a parcel is, right. So, like it's like water or an easement or or mineral, like there are different specialties in those areas that you can help them out with and you know. Get to know your community, like I always joke around. Like in a city right, it's your, it's your barbershop and your style salon. Right, like that's where the gossip happens. I grew and I only say this cause I grew up working in one. It's my family business. Like the gossip mill, is the feed mill right? Like that's you get to know the feed mill. Get to like that's where all the gossip happens. You get to know the feed mill, that's where all the gossip happens?
Speaker 1:Coffee shops, feed mills, scale houses, yeah, all those places where everybody hangs out and talks about whoever didn't show up today. Yeah, yeah, hey brother, I'm having a great time here, but if we can take a quick break, you got time for just one more segment, absolutely yes. All right, man, I appreciate you doing this. We will be right back.
Speaker 4:If you want to be a professional land broker, there's no other organization for you but RLI. I mean it gives you the education, the experience, the knowledge and the networking that help your business succeed. It sets you apart from anybody else.
Speaker 2:Who really knows what the future is going to bring, but I can guarantee this the land real estate industry is not going anywhere, and being associated with our organization brings a lot of value to each individual broker.
Speaker 1:All right, we're back here with Mac Christian from National Land Realty. Mac, you know what? You're the first National Land Realty person I've had on my podcast. I think your guys are snobby, maybe, or something, I think we are too.
Speaker 3:We're very yeah.
Speaker 1:I'm just kidding.
Speaker 3:We've got more than him. Yeah, yeah, no.
Speaker 1:I just actually ran into Jeremy down in Oklahoma. Him and I were both guest teachers for the boot camp this year for RLI's ALC. I was going to say it was the ALC program.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and so he is always such a great guy to bump into in the world from Arkansas, jeremy Stevens, and so it was fun to see him. He did set me up to fail, though, because he has a two-day class right of transitional land. I had a one-day class. That is normally two days, so I had to cram two days of class into one day, and he had let them out fairly early the day before my class, so when I came in there and made them stay all day, I wasn't very popular, see.
Speaker 3:Jeremy plays dirty.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he was pretty mean and I did have a good time, though. That was a great group and I'm looking forward to those guys that were in that class getting their ALC. I think that, man, every time I meet with these guys that are coming up in the industry, there's just more and more incredible people in the farmland, ranch and land world.
Speaker 3:And everybody that goes and gets their ALC. That's the one similar. There's a commonality with that. They've got that hustle, they've got that. You know there's that extra little kick that they're going to go chase that down because it takes a good chunk of work.
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, I don't know if you get to hang out with the RLI people very often.
Speaker 3:And if you don't, they haven't let me in there.
Speaker 1:I recommend, recommend man, go to a national land conference sometime. I need to go check that out. Just go hang out with the, with them people, because it will give you such an, it just gives you such a breath of fresh air of what the industry really is all about, because they're just it's just so incredible. How many people are there to lift each other up. I mean it's just true. I mean, yeah, like in living room, yeah, we're up against each other, but other than that, it's how can I help? How can I help you know, my, you be better?
Speaker 3:How can I help the industry improve, you know, and so when our industry is a little weird, like that, right, because, because even the residential industry like you can throw your competitors under the bus a little easier in the residential industry. But it's like if you're in a rural community, like this person is probably your neighbor, that's your competitor and everybody knows them too, and everybody knows where they were last Wednesday, and if you aren't willing to work with that person, it's not going to be very fun. Like there's so much collaboration that happens in our industry. It's like you have to do that, you have to build each other up.
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, and you like I always laugh because I came I'm a late bloomer to the industry. I had a couple other careers before I got here, and so my thing was is like I made no bones about it, like we got in the industry to make it better. Our area it was kind of, in my opinion, it was, you know, like I don't know. They think that they're good people, all of them are really good people that just kind of gotten in that rut of phoning it in, you know, and didn't have to work too hard, and so we thought there's better ways to do it and so that's why we started. And I've always used social media as a way like you don't know who necessarily is looking at your social media, but a hundred percent of your competition is, and so I've always used that knowledge to talk to them. Yeah, so when you're out there you have a message. You can subtly tell your competition exactly what you want them to know. So we've always used that to maybe change their minds on some stuff. But, uh, no, but let's talk.
Speaker 1:Talk about having like a really awesome podcast, because you really do. Man, I honestly am a huge fan. I listen to the National Land Realty Podcast driving around. I mean, what's really fascinating is how many cool agents you guys truly have. The list keeps going on of what you can pull out of your closet over there and just call a national land agent. I'd like do they actually list and sell property? Or are you just thinking of getting licenses so you can say hey, we've got like this NASCAR driver, that's a sells land?
Speaker 3:I, yeah, I think we have uh pretty sure you do.
Speaker 1:I have no doubt.
Speaker 3:At Fish Parker. I think his family is like NASCAR I think it's Bass Fishing or NASCAR Crap, I can't remember but no, that's super cool. We didn't set out with the goal of like having a cool podcast. I talk about it. On the podcast, a lot is.
Speaker 3:I saw it as a good way to generate content that we could. It would give my copywriter a faster time to create content by running interviews, because it's anybody in marketing If you ever listen to Gary Vaynerchuk is a real popular guy. He always talks about hub and spoke models for marketing. And so we wanted to set that up and we use the podcast as a content driver. And so when I wanted to set up, it's like we got to do a podcast, a quick way to get content. It's valuable content, we can share that content and that's great.
Speaker 3:And then it was like, okay, who's going to do it? So I went around it like CEO should do it, and the CEO was like, nah, never, okay, well, president, you should do it. Nope, and I went to brokers and, um, at the end of the day it was one of those like, if it needs to get done, I'm just going to do it. And so I ended up being a half I think half the agents at National Land think that I just do the podcast and that's all I do and I phone it in as soon as I do the episodes. But yeah, it's really fun and right now the way we manage is my content guy. He'll run keyword research and find out what new topics are out there and he will chase somebody down and he just throws them in my schedule and I have all these reviews and half the time I forget who they are in the first place and I don't know what company they are and I gotta refresh my.
Speaker 3:So we're moving at a really fast pace now, um, but then it's also like agents. You know, like um, there was an agent just the other day that, uh, that I found out they had some I can't remember what the background is at this point, but they had some kind of of unique background and I think it was with, uh, with timber stands or something like that, or timber analysis, and I was like, hey, get this guy. I like trees and you know I want to. I want cause for me. I'm pretty curious and so if I find some weird fact about what they're doing, it's like I want to learn about that. So let's get them on. Um yeah, no, I thank you. That's, that's really cool, and and likewise your, your podcast is phenomenal too.
Speaker 1:so, um yeah, that's, I got some mutual love, man yeah, no, I think like it seems like and I, you know, like doing this podcast, I I have to like some of the stuff though that you go through. You are so raw with what you do and it's like I can kind of chuckle and appreciate, like when you were transitioning into the way you do your intros and stuff like that, you know, and like just kind of the like bear with me stuff and it's like you just take everybody with you through it and it's just like so fun and and again, like that. I mean I think that's what makes it just, it's it just makes it real to everybody is just the fact that you're not trying to. You know, like National Land is a big deal in our industry. Right there, they are a juggernaut and there's nothing you know.
Speaker 1:Say whatever you want to, it's it's the truth. They've they've worked hard, they've got great agents, they, they've done all the, the, the things and and you could go a different way with that podcast. You really could. You could have a huge production. You could hire probably some personality to come in and do it and you could, you know. But I just love the fact that I think it's probably more effective the way that you do it. It's just have. Have your guys come on talk about real things that are going on in in your company, and you know and I, and that's, I think, why I enjoy it. I think if you were to do it the other way, I probably would not listen to it.
Speaker 3:Honestly, just, you know, know well, and it's to get other, because nobody wants to listen to me for now, if I can get somebody else to like be the the highlight, that's. That's the sweet spot. Um, and that's what it is like. Originally it was to highlight, the original intent was to highlight our agents and and then we realized we could get access through our audience to get in touch with people that maybe our agents want to hear from, and that's where we've got these guests from, like like bow hunter magazine or or we we talked to former mac with jackson and let me tell you, going from talking timber stands to a world famous economist, and I've got to do the mental gymnastics of like, how do I not sound like a fool in the next 10 minutes? That part's real fun.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I love those episodes when you do that, because that guy is extremely.
Speaker 3:He's so smart oh my gosh.
Speaker 1:You like tee that up pretty good, because you make it known that you're, like this guy's way smarter than I am. Yeah.
Speaker 3:I'm never going to try to pretend to be something. I'm not because it's like, okay, here's the deal, I'm gonna sit in the back seat and this person is really smart.
Speaker 1:But you like, you figured out how to get him on. Like what? Do you have him on quarterly or something. Yes, yeah that's awesome and that's good. Like again, that's a good report. I think I actually share those out, like through my podcast page or something, just because, like, that's just cool information to have.
Speaker 3:It is, it's so, and then, like that's where it's like, do I, do we think it's valuable, like okay, cool, let's get that in front of people that might think that's interesting. Um, he's yeah, those and I'm so grateful that we got guests like that. Those are really cool moments to be able to do stuff like that. I feel really privileged.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that is one of them. That's pretty neat. What was one that really surprised you? What was an episode that you did that was just like you kind of thought, this is probably maybe just going to be an average one, and then it was like, wow, that was pretty cool.
Speaker 3:You know one that's really fun is actually one of our agents. Um, it was like the second or third podcast I ever did, so I've gone back and listened to it and I'm terrible, but like I listened to myself, it's like that's cool, mac, how many times can you say um in one sentence? That's, that was great. So, and it's just, I can't stand hearing my voice anyways. Like it makes me crazy. Like every time I hear it it's like, oh my God, there's, they should remove me.
Speaker 3:Background was he worked with Chevron and Texco and all these big oil companies and we brought him on to talk about mineral rights and I'm sitting there in the back of my head thinking how interesting is this topic? And to this day, it is the heaviest downloaded episode we've ever done and it's not even close with anything else. There's, I think, over a thousand downloads now or something like that on this one episode and it's just him talking about the rights that you have in your property and the rights that you might not have. That one did surprise me because it was like it totally blew up. It was very, very cool to do that. Uh, there's we. We get like we get some weird ones on there once in a while and I'm saying weird cause it's not really what you would think of Like we just we just did one with, um, uh, 830 essay, 831, admin, or something like that.
Speaker 3:If you go back, I don't know off the top of my head what exactly the name of the company was, but it's the name of the tax code that they actually work with is where you can set up your own insurance program, and it's like well, what's that do with? Well, every single agent in national land is a business, like every real estate agent in the world is a 1099 worker, right? Well, okay, there are some companies that do salary and you're not 1099. But for the most part, everybody is. And you have your own business and half of the agents that we have run their own farms and have their own operations and other side businesses, right?
Speaker 3:So we got this company on that talked about how to use the tax code to create your own insurance program to cover the things that your insurance doesn't cover, those kinds of ones. Like I go in like, oh no, this is, I don't know how this is going to fit and would just do it anyways. And you get done and you're like okay, that was actually a tremendous amount of value. That was very cool. Um, so there's stuff like that. Uh, even even your tax code one, 80 stuff. I didn't understand it at first and they had Alec being on there for just a little bit and I'm like, oh my gosh, this dude just blew my mind. You know there's, those ones are fun too.
Speaker 1:Well, and actually like that one 80 stuff I think you guys had, was it Alec or somebody else was on like a year or so ago? Yeah, it was Alec, yeah, yeah, so you had Alec on and that's the first time I heard about it. Yes, I actually heard about that, researched it and then started, started using that in my business from your podcast right Before I you know, and so I mean I guess that's you know, like I'm not national land, right?
Speaker 3:So I never heard. I didn't even know it was a thing. When he came on I thought it was a borderline scam, I right. So like he came on talking about tax code 180 and I'm sitting there like OK, how fast is somebody going to get audited when they do this, man, because this, this sounds like, how fast is this going to be an irs thing? And and then you learn about it and it's not, and and it's this really cool, like now, it's like how could you do an ag piece without that?
Speaker 1:you know that's well, yeah, it's just like well, and then again it's just like. Goes back to how all these people creating this value that we can bring to our clients and say like you know, like, how can you say like a pasture is only worth $800 an acre when you can add three, four or $500 of value with?
Speaker 3:just that. In some cases thousands per acre. You know like that's no, that was.
Speaker 1:That's pretty insane. No, no, you, I will say, um, I, I I will tell everybody that listens to this one If you have not heard your podcast. There are some really, really cool stories that your agents and that you have had on there that I think you had in a guy that from I think it was Tennessee or something that was uh, um, I think he was something to do with the big bakery or something that one of your agents like wasn't, or no, it was the, the restaurant chain. Am I wrong there?
Speaker 3:I'm trying to think there was a gentleman that did restaurants. He was a newer agent.
Speaker 1:He took all the restaurants and put them all in the same spot. Right, yes, like Uber restaurants or whatever it was. It was I can't remember his name now newer agents all the restaurants and put them all in the same spot. Right for the yes, like uber restaurants or whatever. It was something it was.
Speaker 3:I can't remember his name now. Um, he just started. He was a brand new agent and he came on and talked about restaurant. I'm like, is this gonna be? Actually you, you queued one up for me too is, um, we had an agent. He'll probably throw something at me because I'm gonna.
Speaker 3:I'm gonna say that I was scared he was going to be really boring at first. It was, but it was like we Drew Drew Allen, I think he was a quail scientist and and I'm and I'm like so we start getting into like the GI tracts of quail and stuff and and like I'm recording it and I'm like, oh, my gosh, is this going to be? What is this going to be? Cause I didn't know at first. I'm fascinated by this stuff, but that doesn't mean everybody else is going to be. So I'm kind of diving in. I think it's cool, but in the back of my head I'm like is this, is this going to? How's this? We got done and it was like this really cool episode. But going in it was I, we've just learned to dive in and, um, you, I, I have yet to do one where I'm like that was terrible. Now, if it's if it's terrible, it's usually on my side of things. People that I'm talking to are usually pretty good.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, there's that that. That is the actual truth. I, I the first couple of them, like it was, the production value was pretty rough. It was a definite learning curve in mind, you know, like as I'm getting trying to get figured out how to do it.
Speaker 3:But uh, then you're faster than me, cause there's like 10 that I'll never listen to again.
Speaker 1:The first one we ever did was like one of my best friends, my wife and I, you know like did it and uh, it's still like one of my best friends. My wife and I, you know like did it and uh, it's still like one of the favorites out there. Just because it's just goofy and yeah, yeah, and nobody like I've I've threatened to take it down before and like people are like don't you dare, that's just, that's history right there. You gotta leave number one's gotta stay out there. So oh, yeah, definitely so I just wanna.
Speaker 1:I do want to mention, though, uh, that you got your real estate license like a year or two ago, right?
Speaker 3:It's like a year and a half.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, somewhere in there.
Speaker 1:Cause I remember like listening to you and you were like, I think at one point you thought this was going to be a pretty easy process. Um, you thought we were. We were a little simpler folk than we really are.
Speaker 3:I think at one point, I got to put my foot in my mouth. Historically, I've tested very well, I study pretty well. I've passed the Series 7, which is like the advanced investment license. I've done the Series 66. One time I was licensed for insurance, I'd done the series 66. And one time I was licensed for insurance, I'd done my MBA program Right and, and and you know, hammer, that I'd pulled a four point in my MBA program.
Speaker 3:Now, granted, I didn't have a life and I didn't sleep and I didn't see my kids and my wife for like two years, but I got a four point and, like you know, I did those things. So I'm going into real estate like, oh, I might go to the classes, I'm gonna take the test and be fine, and I got, I started getting smoked, it started working me over, um, it was. It was not the easiest thing that I've done, um, so it was, uh, that was. I did that originally because I wanted to. I didn't. I would I should have, if anybody from if susan, if you're listening would I should have. If anybody from, if Susan, if you're listening to this, I should have got this onto my compensation package, right, but, um, no, I did it in my spare time. Uh, I wanted to go through what our agents go through and what everybody in the field has to go through and and go through the licensing and have to keep up licensing and stuff.
Speaker 3:Originally I was thinking I was going to run a side hustle and sell some land, because it's like you know, I do the thing and I work for the company I should have, I should do the business and I don't have time. I work, I work nine, you know, eight to five every day. Half the time it's eight to seven. Anyways, when I clock out it is like I'm off into the wilderness with my family and I'm shooting bows and catching fish and hunting and hiking and stuff. So I don't want to impose on that, so I don't do it. I marketing is good enough, but yeah, the real estate exam and pass and all that, I I'll still throw some referrals, I'll do some business if it falls in my lap, but it hasn't yet.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, I, I am proud of you. That was. I remember you going through that process, listening to your podcast, and you were talking about it and and so I, I have got my license in 10 States now. So, oh my gosh, so I'm I'm not real bright cause I'm just a glutton for punishment, but but you got that hustle obviously.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh, after you get one, it's not. It's not as hard as you think. I don't know if I agree with that. That test sucks, obviously. Oh my gosh, after you get one, it's not as hard as you think. I don't know if I agree with that. That test sucks. You just have to do the state one for each of the tests. You don't have to do the national one over and over again. Thank goodness.
Speaker 3:Yeah, actually, two houses down from me is a whitetail agent that runs my territory and he just happened to move next to me in Boise and I kept on seeing his truck go by and I went to hassle him and he ended up being somebody. He also listened to the pod Like you're, mac, we're chitchat here and there now, but he's a super awesome guy. But I was talking to him through the test and he's like what you mean to tell me you can't pass that test? I'm like no, it's small, it beat me up right now. It was like a nonstop. He'd drive by, making fun of me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the only one that I struggled with was Kansas, and my joke to the Kansas people was I had to finally dumb myself down to go take the test because it's coming at it too smart. I like that approach. I like that approach. They don't. They thought I was just. I. Actually I thought I don't. I think what it was was I just assumed I knew enough when I went and took it and I finally had to actually go study and take it. But for a couple of times I went to take it. I thought, man, how hard can it be? And it was fairly difficult. Oh, it's not hard, huh, it was a little harder than it should have been, I think. But uh, no, it was. But now, yeah, it's, it's a it's a fun gig though.
Speaker 3:But yeah, I think you might have the most licenses of anybody I've talked to I uh, there's a few people out there, I think jeff.
Speaker 1:Uh, oh, jeff post from people's company has 20 some. I think he's there. Yeah, he's there. Uh, I think that's his job, though. He's like their compliance broker, so like, okay, he does for a living. Is you make sure that they the rules are followed for them?
Speaker 3:I'm trying to think. There's a couple of hours that are like five or six states. I don't know of anybody rocking 10.
Speaker 1:Well, yeah, you guys just got Joel King too, didn't you? Yes?
Speaker 3:He just went through boot camp I actually don't know how many he's licensed in. I talk to him, I do the um, the marketing onboard, and then our crm system onboarding and like I feel so bad because everybody gets fed with a fire hose and I know that there's so because half of what I'm talking about is software and it's like I I just watched three eyes roll into the back of somebody's head like there's everybody's falling asleep during my stuff. Um, um, you know, cause nobody wants to listen to software but the. So he just went through that. Um, yeah, he's, it seems like a super cool guy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he was my first class in RLI. He taught um, he taught recreational properties.
Speaker 3:Yeah, he's kind of a monster in the industry, so it's like it's super cool to have him on board.
Speaker 1:He is awesome. I really dig that guy.
Speaker 3:He is awesome, which is a reminder I need to get him on the podcast.
Speaker 1:Yeah, there you go. You better get him on there. He's very smart. Well, brother, I think I've taken way more of your time than you've been very generous today with me. I have appreciated it and had a great time, and uh, um, so I uh, how do uh? I'll probably just put your company's website and, uh, just the main phone number for anybody wants to get in touch with you guys. Um, we did do.
Speaker 3:I don't want to have you promote us too much.
Speaker 1:No, I, I don't have any problem with that, no, we just did. Actually, our two companies did this massive auction project together in Texas. It was really a fun project where we had a huge tract of land that we Is that with Weems? I think so. Yeah.
Speaker 1:The Delta auction that we I think we're still working on together. So it was a lot of fun, and so I think that's the way success looks like in the future of our business is taking all the horsepower we can and putting it together and seeing what we can do for our clients. And I know that client was in a difficult situation and I think they're happy with everybody.
Speaker 3:so so, yeah, yeah, I and I, I I cannot thank you enough for throwing the it's, because I feel like everybody in our industry kind of like we all know each other, everybody collaborates together. But there's also this kind of like everyone kind of sits back on the other opposite corner of the room and kind of glares at each other, like there's, it just depends because everyone's real competitive, and so I'm, I'm really, I'm really happy you reached out. This is very, very cool. I, I, I didn't you never know if anybody's actually listening, right. So I was like, okay, that's, that's really you know, you know who we are, because I have bounced around and listened to yours as well and run through that. So it's like kind of a mutual admiration thing. And I was like, wow, okay, yeah, I'd love to be on that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like I said, I can't tell you how many times I've shared your stuff out. I know several agents from National Land. I actually looked really, really hard at your company when I was getting ready to switch Um. At the time it just wasn't a great fit for me, so yeah yeah, but um had had a different idea of what I was wanting to do at the time. So, but, um, but yeah, no, nothing, nothing against them. It was. I love Logan, they were, and uh, ronnie, I think they're.
Speaker 1:I have nothing but great things to say about him If you go through Ronnie and he didn't sell you on the company man, you definitely had a, you knew what you were looking for, because that guy yeah, and of course Aaron Graham is kind of a big deal in Nebraska too.
Speaker 3:Yes, yes.
Speaker 1:Yep Talked to him and everybody and it was just um, it was I. The first time I talked to him, um, I had an opportunity to help start a company that didn't I just didn't fit real good with. And then the second time around it was um, just not a good fit again.
Speaker 3:So yeah, that's the unique part about our industry is is every, every person's an individual and they have to be very selective when they go to a company, because you're jumping into a culture and you're jumping into a dynamic and it's got to be the fit for you. Just because it's really big doesn't mean it's for you, and just because it's really small doesn't mean you shouldn't do it. Um, so it's like everyone's got to take their fit. Of course, you know all of us want to say that our company is the best, but I best.
Speaker 1:but I mean the truth of it is you have to be really selective and and and do that, so, um, well, and I think, I think that the the thing I will say is is what you can say about character is is it's not necessarily always when you win. It's. You learn more about character when you lose. And I can say that lauren and logan um were awesome, you know, and still, to this day, are awesome to me. So every time I see him and talk to him, so I I think you guys are great.
Speaker 3:So Yep, and there was infinite knowledge in that statement you just made. That's a yes.
Speaker 1:All right, brother. Well, thanks again for your time and we will see you all down the road.
Speaker 2:As we wrap up another episode of the American Land Seller podcast. Thank you for joining us. Visit wwwamericanlandsellercom and find us on one of your favorite podcast platforms. If you would be so kind and you enjoyed today's insights, please like, subscribe, rate, follow and review us on whatever app you are listening or watching on. Connect with us on social media for updates. Until next week. Kobe wishes you success in your land endeavors. God bless you and have a great week.
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